amyjenner: February 7, 2020, 12:49pm
I have in my notes that Toby uses HT + Liv + SI for severe menstrual pain. I’m wondering how that is done
exactly. I have been using Liv rt and HT lft for menstrual pain when it is other times in the cycle and the pain is not
currently present. And Liv + SI if it is a bit present. That has been effective over time. I have a new Px whom I saw
for the 1st time a few days before the period pain started. She is a ST body type, SJxs in her sensitivity to the world
and in her 30’s. She called when the period started to say she was having a lot of pain. She didn’t want to come in
to the clinic so I didn’t end up treating her during the acute, but I got to wondering how I would treat her if she had
come in. I was thinking about the above combo and realized I didn’t know how I would do it…
KristinWisgirda: February 7, 2020, 6:55pm
Hi Amy,
I think that this is another situation where you use your clinical judgement based on presentation.
While you can combine H and Liv or Liv and SI, treating a single channel is often the way to go. If there are little
to no concerns about K weakness (SI excess), SI+ is probably the first option to consider since it helps pain in
general and dysmenorrhea can be thought of as a sign of blood stasis. If the presentation is cold, H+. If SJ excess is
strong and maybe the pain has a spasm/tight quality, Liv+.
I haven’t treated severe dysmenorrhea as it is happening with Saam yet. Lesser cramps respond well with the
strategies above. Most often, I am using SI+ by itself.
amyjenner: February 8, 2020, 1:43pm
that brings up another question I have about treating folks with chronic pain. Menstrual is often chronic, just
cyclical… SI + works so well for pain but I wonder about over using it in someone who has chronic pain. I have
been having success with SI and then over time, like in the woman I presented on the webinar last weekend, the
pain creeps back over time. What is happening there? I’m assuming I keep looking for more of a root cause,
keeping in mind the strength of pathogen/condition and constitution of px. But would it make sense to use Kid
once in a while in a toggle sort of way, when there is blood stagnation and pain?
KristinWisgirda: February 8, 2020, 4:15pm
amyjenner:15/01/2024, 17:10Severe menstrual pain – Qiological Community
https://forum.qiological.com/t/severe-menstrual-pain/879/print2/2
I’m assuming I keep looking for more of a root cause, keeping in mind the strength of pathogen/condition and
constitution of px.
Your Crowdcast cast last week was a great example of having to consider all of the facet’s of the patient’s
presentation, constitution along the the environment. Some patient’s just need support from lots of different angles.
amyjenner:
But would it make sense to use Kid once in a while in a toggle sort of way, when there is blood stagnation and
pain?
Kidney is definitely something to consider, especially if there are SI excess signs in any form. As well, there is a
relationship between the Kidney and reproductive organs.
What we think of as the primary factors in pain- qi and blood stasis- can be secondary to other pathodynamics, as
you know. Dampness, cold, deficiency, heat should all be evaluated too. The GMP has given you a great
foundation for understanding the interplay of all of the above. Studying with Sharon has definitely given me a leg
up in using Saam more effectively.
michaelmax: February 23, 2020, 9:13pm
HI @amyjenner
Yes, Toby warns us against using the same channel too often, and I’ve found this to be the case as well.
For issues with pain, especially chronic pain, it is important to see what else is there. Are they damp, or dry? Do
they have a hyper awareness of the world and themselves (excess TB)? Do they have that aggressive but perhaps
knotted up Yang GB Wood?
The beauty of this method is that we are invited to see “who else has come to the party” and so can cycle through
organs that need some attention