Adina_Kletzel: January 15, 2020, 8:40am
For someone who has very dry lips 9+, very dry skin on hands and feet 10 +
but stools are damp and loose 7+
I could do tonify St
BUT since the lips are an expression of the state of fluids in the stomach
I am concerned to bring drying energy to the stomach
Is this a correct way of viewing dry lips in Saam or are dry lips just dry on the outside and damp stool is damp on
the inside?
Lu 10 is puffed out. He is not at all wealthy but views himself as fortunate and having what he needs.
THanks
KristinWisgirda: January 15, 2020, 4:43pm
Practicing Saam, we will never stop asking “Is it interior or exterior? Do loose stools mean that damp needs to be
dried interiorly or that fluids need to be better absorbed interiorly?”
I posted a case here of very dry cracked lips. Whatever I did (Lung+???) really helped her lips but stirred up her
allergy symptoms.
Good luck to us all.
bxiong89: January 15, 2020, 9:30pm
Can I ask whether the tongue was an enlarged and damp looking tongue?
I think I would typically look at lips as a the exterior to the mouth organ and the tongue and palate as inner. That is
just the way I would interpret it though…correct me if wrong @KristinWisgirda
Why don’t you give ST+ a shot and see if it works, and it will become quite apparent afterward…Some of the most
profound SAAM learning that happened for me occurred with mistakes!
For example, I was certain a patient was SP+, he was presenting with numbness along the LI channel and was quite
large with huge cravings for sugar! Immense cravings for sugar. I tonified LI as a result.
The next few treatments, he said the numbness had improved a little but not much.
It wasn’t giving me the results I typically saw for SAAM, I told him that it wasn’t the acupuncture that was the
issue and that it was me and my diagnosis.10/01/2024, 13:06Dry lips and damp stools – Qiological Community
https://forum.qiological.com/t/dry-lips-and-damp-stools/838/print2/4
Then I realised he was also presenting with numbness along the SJ channel and that he had lumped the numbness
altogether, hence the small improvement.
Feet were icy cold, sudden changes to temp, bright eyes, photosensitivity, detail orientated, was looking after a
chronically ill wife, controlling, incredibly polite. Textbook SJ+ case
All of a sudden, the strategy switched to supplementation of LV. Next follow up Tx, no numbness at all.
That’s not to say that LI/SP wasn’t involved, it just goes to say that SJ/LV was the grossest thing, but I was too
biased to see it with everything else in front of me…and didn’t delineate further.
Good luck with your case and let us know how you went!
Adina_Kletzel: January 15, 2020, 9:58pm
HI,
The tongue is not enlarged and damp looking
It has some dry damp coating in the LJ, some patches of very little coating, and red tip, and pale sides.
Thanks for your case. It’s great to learn from others’ cases.
I will let you know what happens.
KristinWisgirda: January 15, 2020, 11:59pm
bxiong89:
I think I would typically look at lips as a the exterior to the mouth organ and the tongue and palate as inner.
That is just the way I would interpret it though…correct me if wrong
This is not clear. Yes the skin is exterior but the lips are a special kind of skin, an extension of the mucosa.
Previously I referenced a case of mine where a Lung+ treatment was very successful for painfully dry lips.
@bxiong89 Thanks for the numbness case as well. With such a strong Spleen excess morphology + numbness, it
would be tempting to try to address damp with different strategies and not look at the whole picture.
Daniel: January 16, 2020, 3:37am
What do you mean by stools are ‘damp’?
is there mucus?
is there blood?
drying can also be due to heat
is he hot or warm – all over all the time or partially some of the time?10/01/2024, 13:06Dry lips and damp stools – Qiological Community
https://forum.qiological.com/t/dry-lips-and-damp-stools/838/print3/4
what is his physique like?
overweight?
thin?
what is his flesh like?
where is he on the couch potato – – – – – hyper industrious spectrum?
mariayung: January 9, 2021, 2:16am
Is it possible to have ST+ and LI+?
I have a patient with RA, swollen joints but dry skin, dry blood shot eyes, dry mouth and throat, nasal congestion.
normal stool.
My assessment:
ST+ ( swollen joints ST 43, thumbs, deflated LU10, financially challenged, not great knees)
LI+ (very busy, dry skin, thin, good teeth, sinus congestion)
SJ+ (very bright eyes, warm upper, cold feet, swollen joints SJ4, LV4)
If I increase inside damp, I am concerned that would make the swelling worse, or is it possible because she is too
dry, the dampness is congealed in the joints. Would appreciate your thoughts. Thanks in advance!
KristinWisgirda: January 9, 2021, 1:55pm
Thanks for your questions.
First a request: for ease of reading please use the + sign to indicate a supplementing treatment. When referring to
channel excess please write excess (abbreviations are fine).
mariayung:
Is it possible to have ST+ and LI+?
Absolutely.
I would add question marks to some elements of your symptom analysis:
mariayung:
ST+ ( swollen joints ST 43, thumbs, deflated LU10, financially challenged, not great knees)
LI+ (very busy, dry skin, thin, good teeth, sinus congestion)
SJ+ (very bright eyes, warm upper, cold feet, swollen joints SJ4, LV4)
not great knees: the strong St excess indication is weakness in the knees, not necessarily pain, especially after a
loss of resources10/01/2024, 13:06Dry lips and damp stools – Qiological Community
https://forum.qiological.com/t/dry-lips-and-damp-stools/838/print4/4
sinus congestion for LI excess: More often you think of sinus congestion being a damp sign rather than a dry sign.
In my experience, itcan also present with other channel excesses for instance SJ, Liver, Heart
To give guidance, we really need a full case study, including ratings of the symptoms on a scale of 1-10.
mariayung:
If I increase inside damp, I am concerned that would make the swelling worse,
It all depends on the overall presentation, chief complaint and intensity of the symptoms. I have successfully used
LI+ and ST+ in patients with internal dryness when the chief complaint is a strong manifestation of damp- for
instance a very swollen joint or a pussy infection.
mariayung: January 9, 2021, 4:21pm
Thank you for your feedback! I will denote as requested for future references.
For this particular patient, her chief complaint is RA with joint pain. But the symptoms are quite mild right now,
slight swelling, slight pain. What stands out the most are the blood shot eyes. She says her eyes are very dry and
very sensitive to light. I have done a LV+ treatment which helped. But the redness is still there which makes me
think it is either caused by heat, or dryness. I was hesitant to increase damp as I was worried about aggravated the
swelling in the joints.