Daniel: August 24, 2019, 10:07pm
As a newbie to this system, I just want to clarify something . . . . is it correct to say that (1) MOSTLY, our rationale
for choosing the channel to supplement is based on choosing the counterbalancing channel to the channel in which
an Excess pattern has been identified (for example, identifying Gall Bladder Excess and therefore supplementing
Pericardium) BUT that (2) SOMETIMES, we choose a channel to supplement based MAINLY on the functions of
that supplementation in itself (for example, supplementing Urinary Bladder because the patient is just so hot and
this is the channel of choice for cooling or supplementing Small Intestine because the patient has significant blood
stasis – induced pain and this is the channel of choice for moving blood and stopping pain)? (Of course I realise
patients are typically more complex than this simple question suggests and we are weighing many more factors
simultaneously – but I am just trying to get clear on the important distinction between the two points above and
their relative importance / significance / weight in this system).
Taran: August 25, 2019, 2:38am
This is a moment when I can hear Toby saying – Sometimes channel, sometimes quality.
sweiz: August 25, 2019, 3:31pm
Hi Daniel,
I think the two choices you gave are a false dichotomy. My understanding is that a GB excess IS a PC deficiency
and a GB deficiency IS a PC excess. A Ht excess IS a BL deficiency and a BL excess IS a Ht deficiency. They are
the same thing so we don t have to look at whether it is a GB excess or PC deficiency. It s like saying something is
too tall which also means it isn t short enough.
For me, the important question is what do I need to bring into the body? And that question is also the flip side of
what is too much in the body?
I am not sure if I answered your question. It didn t seem that your question was about channel vs quality but maybe
I am not getting your question correctly.
michaelmax: August 25, 2019, 7:55pm
26/01/2024, 11:28Clarification on Choice of Channel Rationale – Sa’am Clinical Questions – Qiological Community
https://forum.qiological.com/t/clarification-on-choice-of-channel-rationale/538/print2/3
Hey @Daniel
As @Taran reminds us sometimes channel, sometimes quality. This is where our clinical eye and sensibilities
are asking to be brought into play. And why some AI function on our palmtop computer could get the basics of
what we work with but not be able to come to the same conclusion a human would
As much as we d like the check list or flow chart (and often in Sa am it is like that) for many cases we need to
make these judgement calls based on clinical experience and maybe a hunch.
@sweiz has a good point too about these are counterbalances. But I suspect you already get that. Still it is helpful
to remember that when describing a HT excess we are also describing a UB deficiency. The story of a SP excess
can also be told as the tale of an LI excess.
Daniel: August 25, 2019, 11:13pm
Yes, I really fundamentally agree with your point Sharon. It just seemed to me, there have been some clinical
examples where, just for example, there really were no Kidney Excess signs or symptoms at all, but there was
intense pain (and blood stasis) and on that basis alone – supplementing Small Intestine was chosen. Now perhaps
implicit in that is an acceptance that there are likely Kidney Excess issues lurking silently below the radar. But
nevertheless, the clinical decision a few times seemed to me to be made quite exclusively on either Small
Intestine s capacity to address blood stasis pain (when supplemented) or Urinary Bladder s capacity to address heat
(when supplemented) – even in the absence of any signs or symptoms of the counterbalancing channel s Excess.
But yes, I do get the core and important feature here – that the two sides of the coin are inextricably just that!
michaelmax: August 25, 2019, 11:38pm
Daniel:
It just seemed to me, there have been some clinical examples where, just for example, there really were no
Kidney Excess signs or symptoms at all, but there was intense pain (and blood stasis) and on that basis alone –
supplementing Small Intestine was chosen.
@Daniel, yes I ve kind of seen it that way as well. Seeing Kidney excess usually revolves around seeing pretty
people with good bone structure, they may or may not have consolidated type stagnation.
IN many ways I think of supplementing the SI as a general purpose move qi and blood , it s tangentially attached
to Kidney excess
Really this is a set of counterbalances that I too am seeking my own clarity on.
sweiz: August 25, 2019, 11:57pm
26/01/2024, 11:28Clarification on Choice of Channel Rationale – Sa’am Clinical Questions – Qiological Community
https://forum.qiological.com/t/clarification-on-choice-of-channel-rationale/538/print3/3
Hi Daniel,
Well if we think of Kidney deficiency as not consolidating the Yin, Yang and Jing of the Kidneys, then Kidney
excess is over consolidation – which is stasis in walks Small Intestine! So the Ki XS is not even really lurking,
it s right there with blood stasis. With the bladder, too much heat IS heart excess. Too much cold is bladder excess.
I can t think of an example where this doesn t hold
michaelmax: August 27, 2019, 2:24am
And here is the kicker with all this
Then things are in balance, you can t see them. It is only as we begin to see the results the imbalance that these
symptoms are able to impress themselves upon our sensorium.
What does perfect health feel like?
It feels like nothing at all!
Jeffrey: August 27, 2019, 2:10pm
Thanks Michael and @sweiz for confirming and driving those clarifications home. It always requires multiple
repeats before before I TRULY groc something. And yes, @Taran sometime channel,sometimes quality is really
starting to stick too.
Thanks yall